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PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:40 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:56 am
Posts: 3
Location: Uden, , NL
Hello ,

Is anybody using Jplay streamer, in combination with the Startech and the Singxer F-1? Without the Startech the F-1 is working without issues. When I put the Startech in, between my server and the F-1, and want to play with Jplay-streamer, the connection between the server and the Startech is lost for a second or 2, and Jplay freezes (cannot reach its controlpanel again). I`ve tried different settings and drivers but no success.

Does anybody have a clue ?

Thanks in advance !!

Maarten


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:02 am 
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Location: Surrey, UK
Hi Wakka,

As a result of your post I have revisited my grounding.

I think the vocabulary that we use for the effects of this sort of pollution is too broad; certainly mine has been, where I tend to use the word 'edge' - a LOT.

In my system I think I have noticed three effects:

1) Hard Sibilants
Hard 's'es. Example tracks:

War of the Worlds – Thunder Child (CD rip & Qobuz)
- Richard Burton has very hard 'S'es.
- Some singing vocals have same issue.
War of the Worlds – Spirit of Man (CD rip & Qobuz)
- Richard Burton has very hard 'S'es.
- Some singing vocals have same issue, Phil Lynott esp.
The Dangling Question - Simon & Garfunkle (CD rip & Q)
- Very hard 'S'es.

These are in the tracks themselves but have been further emphasised in my system.

I also here the effect in hard higher frequencies, such as cymbals. This can sound like increased detail, and on some tracks is positive; making it more difficult to identify as an issue.

2) Noise Floor
This has been effected in my system by both improving the grounding AND improving the quality of the source electricity, e.g. LT3045.

3) Hard Vocals
This is a new one I have noticed, due to your post above.


In terms of grounding in my system I have tried:

a) The John Swenson Widgets (JS), links above;
b) My system, of running a wire from all the cases of items in my digital chain back to my pre-amp (MS); and now
c) BOTH.

In the case of (a) and (b) the wires are fed back to an earthing block that is then connected to my pre-amp.

The effects of changing the grounding take a while to surface, like water finding a level.

With BOTH in place schemes in place I became aware of a hardness in vocals that was unpleasant. Try almost an Tori Amos track, where she really leans on a note it is not nice.

Running either (a) or (b) this effect ALMOST disappeared.

So, (a) = (b)? NO.

This is all really subtle, but, in my system:
Scheme (a) - Hard vocals were minimised;
Scheme (b) - A touch more hard vocals, BUT also a bit more detail - slightly more transparent, able to follow detail in the music a bit more easily.

As I am in the UK, and I am NOT convinced that (a) is entirely safe, I am running happily with (b).

I am now sensitised to type (3) effects, and so I know I will now spend some time trying to remove it. If I find anything I will report back.

Next step:
A second DAC bake off, Border Patrol vs Audio Note 2.1 and 4.1.

M


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:03 am 
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Location: Surrey, UK
Maarten,

Could you go into a bit more detail on how your system is set up.

M


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 6:33 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:56 am
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Location: Uden, , NL
Dear Mr. Underhill,

My system (very roughly) ; AudioConsulting isolation transformer-Musicserver (windows 10 pro/mobo Gigabyte Ga-x170-extreme ecc)-startech-EA overdrive-Ear890-Maggies 1.6

Today I took my usb stick with some music files out of the Startech, put it in the music pc. The result was that Jplaystreamer didn`t freeze immediately, but still no sound . 2 lights on the F-1 did lit up. So I started to play with different settings, but whatever I did ... no sound. I also tried jplay-mini, still no sound.

I guess I better contact Marcin from jplay , maybe he can provide some insight.

Anyway , I seriously have my doubt if I can succeed this route.

Regards Maarten


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:45 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:10 am
Posts: 79
Location: Madrid, , ES
Hello Maarten2

In my case I use the Foobar and the JRiver Media and in some occasions, the SU-1 that I have, is not recognized by the PC. I solve it by turning the Startech off and on. This only happens to me from time to time and only at the first start, afterwards it works for me without problems.
Some time ago I also had similar problems and I blamed it for using a USB cable without shielding contact between connector A and B.

¿Have you tried another player and it happens with all the file formats?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:50 am 
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Posts: 121
Location: Surrey, UK
Hi Maarten,

Sooo, I take it that:
>JRiver is loaded on the MusicServer;
>The StarTech is plugged into the MusicServer; and
>The F1 is plugged into the MusicServer via another USB socket?

Assuming that is true - how do you control JRiver?

>>Have you checked the Win10 logs to see if anything is being reported?
>>Have you used MMC to look at what hardware is being reported?

EAR890:
This used to be my dream power amp. When I was looking, over a decade ago, they were like rocking horse excreta so a 'settled' for an EAR534 - something I have never regretted.

Tim de P. is a very interesting character. I have taken the 534 home a couple of times to be serviced.

Cheers,

Martin


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:46 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:56 am
Posts: 3
Location: Uden, , NL
Hi Folks ,

today I got a reply from Marcin/Jplay. He assumed that the Startech does not tollerate low latency. Also in the beginning of this thread Rob mentioned that Jplay had its issue (allthough not clear what exactly). I don`t feel like trying another player because I like the Jplay/minimserver configuration. I`m using a rednet 3 , and was looking for some upgrades. Isolating the data with the Startech surely did, but apparently adding the F-1 is a bridge too far , without overhauling my whole system.

But anyway, gentlemen, thanks for your concerns !!

Maarten


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:58 am 
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Posts: 121
Location: Surrey, UK
Hi Maarten,

Damn. Interesting.

Have you tried Logitech Media Server?

M


Last edited by Mr Underhill on Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:00 am 
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Posts: 121
Location: Surrey, UK
Introduction

Visited by Metatron and George47 from UKs WigWam yesterday, together with George's AudioNote (AN) 2.1, an AN4.1 he is currently sheltering and the Matrix SPDIF 2 that he recently reviewed.

I bought a Schiit Eitr and so we had a three way comparison between my current DDC, the SingXer F1, the Matrix and the Eitr.

The main aim was to repeat the get together a couple of weeks ago where we compared the AN2.1 and Border Patrol (BP) DACs in Metatron's system, but in mine.

My system (briefly):


USB Storage/StarTech/Raspberry Pi 3 powered by R-Core Chinese LPSU via LT3045
Sonore ultraRendu powered by R-Core Chinese LPSU via LT3045
DDC
DAC
EAR868/EAR534
Focal 1008be II

One thing I have been wrestling with for months is edge. I think there are a number of reasons for this and present in different, although similar, ways. I have made progress but this was again bothering me, especially as I thought I had more or less put it to bed a few weeks ago - this was a driving force behind trying the different DDCs. They made NO DIFFERENCE on the edge front, but something else did, which I will return to later.

We made up a review music list, which was modified over the day: See Appendix A.

The DDCs
Metatron was delayed so George and I initially compared the DDCs. My view:

F1
https://www.shenzhenaudio.com/singxer-f ... rsion.html
Detailed.

Eitr
http://www.schiit.com/products/eitr
Detailed. Bit more weight to the intruments. Bass perhaps a touch better defined.

Matrix
http://www.matrix-digi.com/en/products/158/index.html
Wow. Detailed. Weighty presentation. Warmer. Excellent sound stage. More below.

The DAC comparisons were therefore done with the Matrix.

The DACs
The DAC comparison was obviously very straightforward: 4.1 > 2.1 > BP. Actually ......no.

I bought the Border Patrol having done long comparisons with the Bel Canto DAC 3.5vb, Schiit Yggdrasil and the Lampizator L4G5. All are good DACs but their presentations will suit different tastes and systems. For me the BP wasn't as detailed as the Yggy, or as euphonic as the Lampizator, but it communicated music in a joy filled and enthusiastic fashion that I find extends any music listening session.

Listening to the AN2.1 at Metatron's was very similar to the BP, but added: a bit more bass weight; detail; and spacial positioning. It repeated this in my system.

The AN4.1 is a bigger and MUCH heavier beast. I believe this IS probably the best of the DACs .....but NOT in my system; system synergy. The 4.1 extracted more detail and nuance but just lacked the boogie factor of the 2.1 and BP.

Intellectually I believe the order of the DACs in terms of detail and presentation is 4.1 > 2.1 > BP; in the right system.
However, in my system the order for me was: 2.1 > (4.1 = BP), where the detail and nuance of the 4.1 was equaled by the BP's boogie.

We ended the day playing Streetwalker and Billie Jean via the 2.1, what a blast.

Edge
While trying the 4.1 we useed the SE inputs, but decided to try the balanced, this failed for some reason (I suspect my cables). I realised that I had plugged the balanced cables into my Oppo 105D a few weeks ago. Removing these cables appeared to reduce the edge we were hearing. I will be testing this again today.

Matrix
I am very impressed by this small box of tricks. It is not simply that I am hearing added detail from very familier tracks it warmth and instrumental weight makes me listen to whole albums where before I might have been inclined to listen to certain tracks.


Conclusion
I suspect I will be buying the Matrix.
I am very happy with the BP DAC, which I think is an absolute bargain. However, if an AN2.1 comes up at the right price I suspect I will find it very hard to resist.


Thanks to George & Metatron.


Appendix A - Music Playlist
-----------------------------
Let Me Touch You Fir a While
Alison Krauss & Union Station Live (Qobuz)
Track includes some high notes that can be hot on my system

Columbus
Mary Black
Live at Oympia (DVD rip > 16/44)
My favourite recorded version of this artist and song.

Keith Don't Go
Nils Lofgren
Acoustic Live
Virtuoso Guitar

Son of Man
Phil Collins
Tarzan Soundtrack (CD rip)
Can be far too hot on my system

Happy
Martin Sexton
Seeds (CD rip)
Sharp Recording

Crucify (2015 remaster)
Tori Amos
Little Earthquakes (Qobuz)

Come Together
Brian Bromberg
Wood (Qobuz)
Big fat bass!

Unfinished Sympathy (2006 remaster)
Massive Attack
Collected (Qobuz)

Hella Bar Talk / Enterprising Young Man
The Music of Star Trek
The City of Prague Philharmonic Orchestra (Qobuz)
Powerful stuff.

Jungle
Tash Sultana
Notion (Qobuz)


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:52 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:10 am
Posts: 79
Location: Madrid, , ES
Your impressions are appreciated Mr Underhill.

With respect to the Matrix DCC, i have also heard good opinions in other forums and it must certainly be a good DCC. I will wait to read more impressions in comparison with the SU-1 to decide if it is worth the improvement.
¿Did you appreciate it superior to the F-1 with enough margin and for example, did you notice the change immediately?

Thank you, a greeting.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:28 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 8:19 am
Posts: 13
Location: Hinterkappelen, , CH
Hi, does anybody has experience with this device? http://www.diyinhk.com/shop/audio-kits/ ... witch.html

Gesendet von meinem DUK-L09 mit Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:31 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 8:19 am
Posts: 13
Location: Hinterkappelen, , CH
I have a chain with MacMini-Amarra 4.0 Luxe - Startech Tx - Startech Rx - F-1 - Processor/DAC.... but it sounds worse than with fiber direct... whats wrong?

Gesendet von meinem DUK-L09 mit Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:02 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:54 pm
Posts: 84
Location: Mariposa, CA, US
Since I think some in this thread are fans and clients, I thought I'd share an important announcement we just made about the UltraCap LPS:
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/foru ... egulators/

:D 8)

--Alex C.

_________________
Music lover; Owner, UpTone Audio


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:23 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2017 3:14 pm
Posts: 121
Location: Surrey, UK
Spark85 wrote:
Your impressions are appreciated Mr Underhill.

With respect to the Matrix DCC, i have also heard good opinions in other forums and it must certainly be a good DCC. I will wait to read more impressions in comparison with the SU-1 to decide if it is worth the improvement.
¿Did you appreciate it superior to the F-1 with enough margin and for example, did you notice the change immediately?

Thank you, a greeting.


Yes. Enough that I will be buying it.

M


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 Post subject: Edge
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:29 am 
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Location: Surrey, UK
WRT

Edge

While trying the 4.1 we useed the SE inputs, but decided to try the balanced, this failed for some reason (I suspect my cables). I realised that I had plugged the balanced cables into my Oppo 105D a few weeks ago. Removing these cables appeared to reduce the edge we were hearing. I will be testing this again today.


I found the reason for this. O had changed what I had under the spikes of my Focal 1008 be 2s. In some ways I preferred what this provided, in one way I very definitely did NOT. I wouldn't say nothing to do with the electronics, as I believe that tones in the signal were being emphasised; but changing back got rid of 95% of the issue I was hearing - but re-introduced others.

At least i know what is happening.

M


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