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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 12:42 pm 
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Location: santa cruz, CA, US
I took a chance on an e bay auction last week.

A Nakamichi 410 Preamplifier, looked a bit moldy in the photos, Im not afraid of mould.

Its doing a lot right compared to the 4 or 5 other mid level, pre amps I have been using for the last 2 years.

Could it sound better then the Yamaha C4 I have ????? unlikely but ...synergy....

$135 to my door, a $5 squirt of deoxit and it seems to be working like new :D

The blurry photo is mine, the clear photo I found on the WWW.

seems some parts are different ?


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 10:36 am 
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@OP, yes, your example seems to have a power transformer.

sheabatter wrote:
seems some parts are different ?


Guess that was Revision 1.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 10:44 am 
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Toby wrote:
@OP, yes, your example seems to have a power transformer.

sheabatter wrote:
seems some parts are different ?


Guess that was Revision 1.


Is a power transformer a good or bad thing ?

should I have it removed and replaced with something ?

or is it ok as is ?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 2:20 pm 
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OK, I was kidding a bit, above.

sheabatter wrote:
Is a power transformer a good or bad thing ?

should I have it removed and replaced with something ?

or is it ok as is ?


The thing I think is a power transformer is the big black flat cylinder behind the metal partition in the unit's top left corner, in the lower (blurry) photo.

Some preamps have switching power supplies, but most don't. A switching power supply does not have a big heavy power transformer, but the more common linear PS does have one. In fact, it needs one very badly, as a first stage in the conversion of alternating current from the wall, to direct current, which can subsequently be made into music.

These two examples of a Nak preamp seem to represent a linear power supply design. So it looks to me as though the unit in the top picture is missing an essential part, and, for that reason, could not be expected to work at all.

@OP, if your unit does have a power transformer, this is good, and you can confidently leave it where it is.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 9:09 pm 
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Thank you ^

I can see 2 holes in the metal plate now where maybe a couple of wires might run to a power transformer if it were there ?

and its GREAT to know the big black PT in there is a good thing, and I don't need to have a tech 'improve' it :D

You say

"These two examples of a Nak preamp seem to represent a linear power supply design"

the layouts look almost identical to me, are they different ?

It sounds great, REALLY great, .......


thanks for your easy and friendly sharing of knowledge .... :arrow:

"Some preamps have switching power supplies, but most don't. A switching power supply does not have a big heavy power transformer, but the more common linear PS does have one. In fact, it needs one very badly, as a first stage in the conversion of alternating current from the wall, to direct current, which can subsequently be made into music"

I had no idea :) ^





Toby wrote:
OK, I was kidding a bit, above.

sheabatter wrote:
Is a power transformer a good or bad thing ?

should I have it removed and replaced with something ?

or is it ok as is ?


The thing I think is a power transformer is the big black flat cylinder behind the metal partition in the unit's top left corner, in the lower (blurry) photo.

Some preamps have switching power supplies, but most don't. A switching power supply does not have a big heavy power transformer, but the more common linear PS does have one. In fact, it needs one very badly, as a first stage in the conversion of alternating current from the wall, to direct current, which can subsequently be made into music.

These two examples of a Nak preamp seem to represent a linear power supply design. So it looks to me as though the unit in the top picture is missing an essential part, and, for that reason, could not be expected to work at all.

@OP, if your unit does have a power transformer, this is good, and you can confidently leave it where it is.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:33 am 
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The layouts are probably identical. The unit in the upper pic has a part missing, that's all.

sheabatter wrote:
the layouts look almost identical to me, are they different ?


That missing part is quite obvious from your posting of the two pics, @sheabatter. There may be more differences too.

Folks tend to tinker with their gear. This rarely has good results. Unfortunately, some tinkerers try to sell the gear afterwards.

Quote:
thanks for your easy and friendly sharing of knowledge


That's what these Forums are about. The key to fine sound at home is knowledge first, money secondarily. Sharing knowledge and experience is what makes this a great hobby.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:52 am 
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Toby wrote:

That's what these Forums are about, Sharing knowledge and experience is what makes this a great hobby,

"Folks tend to tinker with their gear. This rarely has good results. Unfortunately, some tinkerers try to sell the gear afterwards



oh sheet, I'm just about to buy a modified pre :D perhaps I need less forum input and should trust my ears ?

but seriously, I am COMPLETELY FASCINATED how its possible to turn a wiggly grove in plastic into

'An elegy to Bill Evans'


and changing the platter mat changes the tone of the whole LP !!!! ????????

fascinating.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 5:27 pm 
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It's true that music is for your ears.

sheabatter wrote:
oh sheet, I'm just about to buy a modified pre :D perhaps I need less forum input and should trust my ears ?


Ears can make much finer distinctions after they are trained.

And working with the eyes and the brain, ears can make decisions which get them good sound for fair money.

If you don't have some training and knowledge about what goes into a good piece of gear, how can you make a clear decision on a piece which has been modified ? You can only take any improvement on trust.

As a general rule, modified gear should throw up a "Caution" flag. Who did the mods ? What kind of training, experience and reputation do they have ? How much does the piece in question sell for in stock form ? How much more ( or less! ) is being asked for the modded piece ?

And then, if you know a little about theory and practice, you can ask which parts have been replaced, and replaced with what ; and the answers will mean something.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:18 pm 
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I make purchases based on the opinions of 100s or 1000s of internet reviewers.I typically buy well respected products from 5 or 10 years ago online somewhere for 30% of what original retail was, needs must.

I can solder a wire to the back of a speaker but that is the total extent of my electronic knowledge, but i see lots of people modd the same item and have similar results, the modded item I am buying has been well respected for a while but is still considered 'budget' even at full retail for many people.

I enjoy my music journey, not frustrated trying to buy the last 2%, weather its been subwoofers in my car or open baffle full range fostex I am always intrigued by what a component can be made to sound like,

but i don't do soldering so I am happy to buy a used product that has been factory upgraded from a reputable seller.

if i don't like the way it sounds i can sell it...

I would LOVE to be able to tinker with old tube amps and my guitars, but i have heard there are some very high voltages in there and I have been known to work on electronic devices while still plugged in, accidentally.....

ill leave the soldering and electronic calculations riaa curves and those tiny coils inside a phono cartridge to smarter people then myself...

Toby wrote:
It's true that music is for your ears.

sheabatter wrote:
oh sheet, I'm just about to buy a modified pre :D perhaps I need less forum input and should trust my ears ?


Ears can make much finer distinctions after they are trained.

And working with the eyes and the brain, ears can make decisions which get them good sound for fair money.

If you don't have some training and knowledge about what goes into a good piece of gear, how can you make a clear decision on a piece which has been modified ? You can only take any improvement on trust.

As a general rule, modified gear should throw up a "Caution" flag. Who did the mods ? What kind of training, experience and reputation do they have ? How much does the piece in question sell for in stock form ? How much more ( or less! ) is being asked for the modded piece ?

And then, if you know a little about theory and practice, you can ask which parts have been replaced, and replaced with what ; and the answers will mean something.

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